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The last 9 posts

Tuesday, September 19th 2006, 11:34am

by cookgraygoose

Ok, got the message loud and clear. I've printed the information on the site you gave us and shared it with my husband. Next step is to hook the pump up and check it out. It's raining here today, thank goodness, so we will wait till tomorrow, hopefully, to check it out and see what the pump will do. Hope you all have a blessed evening and we will look forward to writing again soon. Thank you again for your knowledgeable assistance. granny

Tuesday, September 19th 2006, 10:53am

by Wet_Boots

<blockquote id="quote"><font size="1" face="Verdana, Arial, Helvetica" id="quote">quote:<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"><i>Originally posted by cookgraygoose</i>I have sent emails out trying to find out more information on the pump as you suggested. It is old and I don't know if the company archives will show up the information requested or not but I am hoping to hear something from them.<hr height="1" noshade id="quote"></blockquote id="quote"></font id="quote">You want to measure actual pump performance, since you might have a worn, underperforming pump. Here's a page about using a ruler to measure the drop from the end of an open pipe, and matching it to a table, to get a flow rate
http://extension.oregonstate.edu/catalog/html/ec/ec1369/

As for reworking the lawn sprinklers, you'd probably be happiest with Maxipaw impact heads, if you have to run on dirty water. Not the first choice for clean city water, but very good for pumped pond water, on the lower pressures from pumps.

Tuesday, September 19th 2006, 9:27am

by cookgraygoose

Wet Boots, thank you for answering. I was writting jmduke7 and didn't know you had also answered. We are so far out in the country that we only have dialup.

I have sent emails out trying to find out more information on the pump as you suggested. It is old and I don't know if the company archives will show up the information requested or not but I am hoping to hear something from them.

The impact heads we are watering the yard with now don't extend out into the lawn area. We drag hoses around to get to the other areas connected to a spicot on the irrigation pipe [I quit watering out of the well as it goes dry too fast]. The pipe being above ground is a hazzard. I personally havn't cut it with the riding mower but once. I won't say how many splices are in the line now though. The elevated heads are great around the beds, but for the expance of lawn or mowed weeds...would leave too much to be desired and be too hard to miss with the mower. I drive the mower like a crazy person sometimes as that ztr will spin round and round. The grandkids like my driving tho and beg to ride. To heck with the cutting pattern, it'll grow back.

Tuesday, September 19th 2006, 8:45am

by cookgraygoose

Now that's my kind of talk! I'm known for my cooking and have blueberries in the freezer just for cobblers. One of our favorites along with homemade icecream. If you'll catch and clean the fish I'll cook em'. I make a mean cheese biscuit. There are some good fish in this old pond.

Now back to work before I'm tempted to break my diet...I like what you said about the cycle stop valve. Our zones will all be different for sure and you are right, the pressure will be different in each one. What you wrote does make good sense.

What we are using on the smaller pump now is a metal foot valve with a screen. It is extended towards the bottom of the pond, where it's about 10' deep, near the 20' deep area. The valve is raised about 2' with a 45* fitting at the end of the pipe so it is not laying near the bottom. Our water is simular to the Okefenokee Swamp which is nearby. And yes, we have high humidity, mosquitos, knats and snakes. My battle this year tho has been with the armadillos!

However, when we hook up the other pump because it is 3 phase it will need to be located on the other side of the pond where it is not so deep. You are probally right in forseeing the problems with the new location and as we havn't purchased the foot valve yet we will gladly take your sound advise. I have printed off these answers and now that dinner is out of the way, I'll check out these sites you have recommended and try to find out more about the pump. Thank you sincerely, granny

Tuesday, September 19th 2006, 7:51am

by Wet_Boots

A 5 HP pump might be able to push as much as 200 gpm, so you need to pipe things to handle such flows. As long as you can run at pressures well below a relief valve's set point, it shouldn't be an issue. Another safeguard is a 'flow detector' switch, like those used in fire sprinkler systems. One of those would provide safety for the pump, in the event that there is no flow in the system.

Dirty water valves are the way to go, if you do split this up into zones. I would exchange the Hunter valves for Rainbird PESB valves. But first, you want to determine the capacity of the pump. There is a "four inch drop" method for measuring flow from the end of a level pipe. You really want to have some gpm and psi numbers to work with, before you go much further.

Another thing to consider, is how much protection you want to provide the pump motor. A relay to turn it on and off is just a start. There are motor control boxes for three phase motors. Maybe you already have one. Some of them have magnetic starters for the pump motor.

By the way, for those who might be wondering, a 'wedge drive' impact head is one which has a special impact arm, to allow positive full-circle operation with smaller-than-usual nozzles.

Agricultural irrigation is a different animal than residential lawn sprinkling. The cost of operation comes into play, which is why you sometimes see oversized piping laid above ground for ag irrigation.

Another ag item is the 'water reel' sprinkler, where a giant water-powered reel winds up the poly pipe that feeds it, while the giant impact head on the reel shoots a hundred feet or more.

By the way, I would tend to leave the existing one-zone lawn sprinkler system alone. Impact heads do better with dirty water than anything else.

Tuesday, September 19th 2006, 5:11am

by jmduke7

I agree with BOOTS about the pump, you definitely need to look up the manufacturer and model number to find out the performance curve. However, I am not a big fan of pump start relays or pressure relief valves. I recommend a product called "Cycle Stop Valves" ( here is a link www.cyclestopvalves.com/index2.htm ), as you will see these valve will deliver constant pressure at variable flow rates. They can be expensive depending on the model, but as I have seen in many cases, they are well worth it. To explain the reasons for my dislike in the psr (pump start relays) they are noisy for one (especially in humid areas or climates) and in most cases with larger pumps, such as yours, they will often fail. Although Hunter makes a quality product, they do not make the relay, they only manufacture the box they install it in. As for the pressure releif, they are sometimes difficult to adjust, what I mean is, you don't often have all the exact same amount of heads and pressure on each zone. Since they are pressure activated, you may have it blowing off excess pressure on one zone and not another. Most people may not agree with me on this, but I would only consider a pressure relief valve if there was only one zone. I have been working with pumps for the last 17 years, and I mean no disrespect to the other members of this forum, but I feel that the cycle stop valve are the only way to go.

As for your choice of valves, if the water is "dirty" or contain amounts of pond scum or algae, I would recommend a scubber valve instead of the standard. This will prevent you from having to clean, replace, or repair your valves after a period of time because of debris being caught in the valve ports (examples of this valve www.rainbird.com/landscape/products/valves/pesb_series.htm or www.hunterindustries.com/Products/Valves/icvfsintro.html ). I would also recommend filtration, such as disc filters, or your standard element filters (only for the irrigation around your house, due to the small spray nozzles you will need to accomidate this task). All of your impact heads should be unaffected by this dirty water.

I also wondered what you were using for an intake screen on your pump, or what you are at least considering? I would recommend a product called Sure Flo self cleaning screen. This screen will continuously clean itself from debris and algae as the system runs. It will most definitely beat taking a swim every few months to clean the alternatives. (here is a link www.sure-flo.com/catalog/pages/SCS_Pg4.htm )

I hope what I have recommended is of some help to you. I wish you the best of luck on you task an only ask for some blueberry cobbler when you are done..... Ha Ha

Tuesday, September 19th 2006, 4:16am

by cookgraygoose

Our friends have hired experts and put in deep wells to water their blueberries. They use misters in the rooting beds and drip hoses in the field. I think the pond water has more nutrients and will be better in the long run for the plants than the cold well water and it is already here and plentiful in drought times. We are over 12" below normal in rainfall now.

We are a mom and pop operation and semi-retired. Our blueberries we hand clipped and rooted last year after the blueberries were harvested from a friends field, about 6000 plants in the July heat and humidity. This year we hand cut around 30,000. We have been collecting up the parts for the field watering system as the plants have been growing as we could afford them. They will be ready for planting about March or April. We have till then to finish figuring all this watering system out and gathering up the materials. We are having to do this the "po" folks way by hand and enjoy watching the plants grow and dream of the fields full of the ripe berries later on.

Our "yard" six years ago was about an acre. We have restored the land around the house with a lot of sweat, chain saws and the box blade on our old tractor and put in drain tile in the swampy areas. This gramma even learned to handle 2 brakes on the 1100 Ferguson and bush-hog the fields. We now have close to 15 acres mowable. It is so nice to be able to see the snakes first. However, we are getting tired of pulling the hoses around from bed to bed.

I appreciate the information on the pressure relief valve. Could you recommend a good one for our size system? The pump is old and has printed on the side Gilbarco, Mo # MN5P32B3, then 1.2 - 1.5 inch per hour on a 100' Dia. tank.

Monday, September 18th 2006, 11:28pm

by Wet_Boots

You should figure this stuff out before you order the equipment. Your pump has a performance curve, which you can read, and then see how many impact heads can be run at one time. (If you have wedge-drive impacts, you might run over a hundred of them simultaneously from a five horse pump)

Speaking of burned-out pumps, you need some mechanical safeguards, like a pressure relief valve that can blow off the pump output, in case there's a stuck valve or a blockage.

Monday, September 18th 2006, 8:12pm

by cookgraygoose

Field irrigation, pumping from pond

We have a 3 phase, 5 HP pump already and want to irrigate an 8 acre field using dirty water from our 18 acre pond with impulse sprinkler heads extended about 4' above the ground for new blueberry fields. The rows will be 10' apart and several hundred feet in length. This is the easy part. We don't know anything about sprinkler systems.

After reading this column, I ordered the ICC 800 Hunter controller, and 8- 1 1/2" PGV valves to get started along with the 3 expansion modules to expand the system to 32 zones for later when we will be irrigating another field or now if needed. I don't know how much water this pump will pump or how many Rainbird 25 or 30 sprinklers we can put on a run or zone.

I was told to get the PSR 53 pumpstart model for the 5 HP motor, however, have only located the PSR 52.

One of our concerns is will the pump be cutting off and on with each zone change, or if the controller needs to be set where each zone start time is overlapped to keep the pump running to prevent the pump from getting burned up?

I would also like to use a zone or two for our yard and wondered if any of the inground pop up heads will work with the dirty or pond water. We have been using the impulse heads with a 3 HP pump out of the pond using a plain timer with no zones without problems. The pvc pipe are all on the top of the ground and the impulse heads on pipes about 4' also above ground. With the dry weather we have been having this year they have kept the plants from dying even though they are not very pretty. We have large spaces and about 6 acres of lawn and flower beds to water and would like to go inground.

Is it possible to use both pumps with the one controller? Which heads would ya'll recommend? We don't have a winter freezing problem as we are near the Florida line. My better half wants to use all schedule 40 pvc pipe. Could someone please explain the different pipes and where they are best used and why.

These are a lot of questions, and we appreciate your time and efforts in answering them. Our wallpaper projects were much easier on us to do togeather than this has been so your help is wonderful!! granny